RideForum.NET

Against my better judgement, I'm going to start another topic on safety gear. I'm talking specifically in regards to off-road trail riding--not backroads.

You've no doubt heard the old wisdom, "If you don't have your health, you don't have anything." Herophilus, a greek physician known as "the father of anatomy", said it well.

Herophilus wrote:To lose one's health renders science null, art inglorious, strength unavailing, wealth useless, and eloquence powerless.

I've wrecked on my last 2 trail rides sustaining injuries both times. Cracked ribs the first time, and ankle ligament damage and a bruised knee the second time. Both accidents were 100% my own fault and definitely avoidable if the right reaction had been made. My ribs still hurt from the wreck in Nov. Now I'm on crutches unable to put weight on my ankle. If you've never walked on crutches, let me tell you it sucks. Forget the knee fatigue in your good leg. Forget the muscle soreness in your arms and shoulders. It's the abrasion on your sides under your arm-pits that will drive you nuts.

My trip to the emergency room cost a $100 copay and I'd gladly pay $1,000 right now if it would make my injuries go away. In a recent forum post, I read that one of our riders suffered a torn ACL. Is this true? That is an injury that usually requires surgery and months of rehab as well as a weakened knee for life. What would you be willing to pay to go back in time and prevent that injury? $20? $500? $5,000? More? My injuries are very minor. I was lucky I guess.

I was first introduced to motocross knee braces by our own Chris Greenhoot. He has, I beleive, a pair of Asterisk knee braces. I was dumbfounded when he told me they cost over $500.00. I thought to myself, "there is no way I'm spending that kind of money". They are usually made of aircraft aluminum, titanium, or carbon fiber and virtually guarantee that your knee will not bend in any way that it is not supposed to. Most include full knee cap impact protection as well. (This would have most likely prevented my bruised knee from Saturday. Thank God I was at least wearing knee pads.)

On one hand, you can say, "I can't afford them." On the other hand, you could argue "I can't afford NOT to have them." I can guarantee you this, if you go down and tear your ACL, you will wish you had spent the money on knee braces. There are lower-cost options. For example, the EVS Vision Knee Brace can be purchased for about $225 over at http://www.motorcyclecloseouts.com. (That's for a pair.) There seems to be no doubt that the Asterisks are the top of the pile. I found the reviews at this website in particular to be a helpful resource regarding knee braces:
http://www.dirtrider.net/drn_tested/kne ... races.html



Boots are another important safety item. When I twisted my ankle, I was wearing $200 Oxtar riding boots. While these offer a lot of protection, and have saved my feet and ankles a number of times during the last year, they do not protect you like full motocross boots, which are more rigid like ski boots. For the rugged trail riding I love to do, it's time for good motocross boots. The Oxtar boots will be my preference for backroad rides. Per Rusty's recommendation, I'm looking at a pair of Gaerne SG10's at http://www.motorcyclecloseouts.com. They are not the cheapest boots, but again, all it takes is one accident and that price becomes irrelevant.

When I wrecked on Saturday, I was wearing my 661 Pressure Suit which offers a lot of upper body protection. I did not get hurt on my upper body at all. I don't know how relevant that is, because as fast as it happened, I'm not sure what hit when and where. But it cost me about $140, and I don't regret it. What is your chest or spine worth?

...and it doesn't matter how good a rider you are--you can be the best rider in the world and still have another rider (or a car) slam into you.

Maybe it's my recent accidents, maybe it's my first child about to be born (due May 18th), or perhaps it's just part of getting older, but all of a sudden, my own mortality is apparent to me. I love riding my motorcycle, and I especially love the challenge of the rugged trails. A life without risks is no life at all, but there are things you can do to put the odds in your favor. I've got a baby girl depending on me now.

Kudos Troy. I'm a walking (sort of) example of injuries that could have been lessened if I had the right gear. Both my knees have been zippered - ACL reconstruction. Both knee injuries in my opinion were made worse by wearing hiking boots with a heavy lug tread. Both times I had my foot planted with full weight, my foot couldn't turn but my knees did!
There is one more piece of equipment that is vitally important - the right bike, properly prepared. Five year ago I had my back fused. The result of a injury 20 years ago. I was riding a heavy dual-sport bike like it was a full bore motocross bike. One misjudged jump with poor suspension, and my back is toast. I still have one more back surgery to go. I also install heavy handguards after witnessing some nasty hand injuries.
Growing up I used to ride in cutoff shorts, sneakers, and a tank top. Once I started riding a mountain bike, I realized how easily you can get hurt an any speed. Now I wear a helmet, gloves, armored jacket, and motocross pants. I also have custom-made knee braces. With the condition of my knees, I would think about wearing them if I was felt the riding warranted.
One truth still exists. Motorcycling is potentially dangerous, no matter how protected or careful you are

MacWildcat wrote:Both knee injuries in my opinion were made worse by wearing hiking boots with a heavy lug tread. Both times I had my foot planted with full weight, my foot couldn't turn but my knees did!

This answers those that say that hiking boots are o.k. Motocross boots have tread, but not too much tread. (And I can walk in them despite what others say.)

And as Troy found out, street boots (or hiking boots for that matter) don't have the ankle support (immobilization) that can come in handy.

And as Mac also pointed out, don't set yourself up for injury with a bike that fails when called upon.

hey man, get the MX boots and everything else you think you might need. even on a DS ride things can turn nuts if you get a little loose or jiggy with the throttle. I wear my Tech 8's and CTI's (think prescription Asterisks) any time there is a good change of planting my foot, dabbing to save a spill or what not. that means all off road and some DS. ACL recon and 4 more surgeries will have you not wanting to repeat the process.

This thread is making me paranoid. Sorry to hear you are hurt again Troy. I've been pretty lucky, all my get-offs have been pretty tame so far and I've always been able to jump back up and get on. Oh, except for the one time I hit a small stump hidden in the grass and flipped a kx-250 over frontwards and planted headfirst into the ground. I found out years later from a chiropractor visit xray that I chipped a vertabre in my neck.

There is a balance to be found, and I suppose that line must be drawn individually. On one extreme, if I absolutely don't want to get hurt riding motorcycles, then I should not ride. On the other extreme, I race enduro's barefoot without a helmet.

For me, a huge part of what I love about riding is the freedom and the open air. A helmet compromises that feeling a lot. However, I've decided that a helmet is necessary despite the reduced freedom. For me personally, things such as good boots, goggles, gloves, knee braces, chest protectors---all of these do very little to detract from the fun and freedom of riding. And in fact, provide a level of protection that allows me to breathe a little easier and enjoy riding the rough stuff all the more.

This discussion is not intended to scare anyone or to increase sales for protection gear vendors. If you want to know the truth, it's basically my way of justifying spending hundreds of dollars on some gear!

I feel naked without helmet, gloves, jacket w/ pads, and good heavy boots.

I still can't force myself to wear riding pants. They make me feel like I am wearing one of those Red Man tactical training suits. Really though, some knee pads might work good. I might stop by 'Closeouts and check some out.

AtGatt rules! All The Gear All The Time. On the street on my 525 EXC or in the dirt--I look like a dirt biker. And I don't mind at all. When crotch rocket guys slingshot by going the other direction and they have on flip flops and shorts I just wince. When I ride at Perry and end up taking 4-wheel riders to the hospital because they had a footpeg go thru their running shoe clad feet, or a head injury from flipping it on top of themselves I see the bodily carnage caused by not wearing protective gear.

You can still sustain injury even if you are properly dressed. I did a couple of months ago and had rotator cuff surgery again two weeks ago. It was a spectacular crash and my buddies had the foresight to applaud my superior efforts. It could have been worse. They could have just laughed at me.

Stu

So I went to motorcyclecloseouts after work. I had never actually looked closely at MX boots. My assumption was wrong. I had assumed they were rigid similar to ski boots. I assumed they immobilized your ankle--I was wrong. In fact, most pairs allowed me to easily bend the ankle over 90 degrees. Preventing ankle ligament damage seems one of the most compelling reasons to buy protective boots. Anyway, seemed to me that the Gaerne SG10's offered the best ankle protection. They also just happen to be the most expensive.

I tried on the EVS Vision knee brace. They are quite comfortable and seem very high quality. At $225 for a pair, they are a lot cheaper than some options. Rusty says next week they'll be getting in the new, fancy carbon knee braces from Fox. ($$$) I'm going to wait so I can compare them.

Troy,

Let us know what you think of the new Fox braces. I didn't know they were even on the market. Give is the old "compare & contrast" on the differences, the features and the benefits from the others! The whole enchilada.

Stu

I have been riding in top quality hunting/hiking boots but after reading this thread I went to motorcyclecloseouts at lunch and purchased a pair of Oxtar Infinity boots. They have some armor that hunting boots don't have but the movement of my foot does not seem any different then my hunting boots. What am I missing?

Troy, here is your homework assignment: Read all you can about PodMX knee braces (the one's distributed by Fox Racing) so you'll be ready to have an intelligent discussion with me next week.

Here is a link to get you started: http://www.podmx.com/

Seriously, these things look great, so I ordered a bunch for the store.

ajayhawkfan wrote:I have been riding in top quality hunting/hiking boots but after reading this thread I went to motorcyclecloseouts at lunch and purchased a pair of Oxtar Infinity boots. They have some armor that hunting boots don't have but the movement of my foot does not seem any different then my hunting boots. What am I missing?

For one thing, the Infinity riding boots are taller than your hunting boots--right? I'd bet they provide a lot more padding on the shin and the hard armor on the sides of the ankle covering the ankle bone is great for gripping the bike without hurting your ankles.

However, you are right--they still allow your ankle to bend sideways unnaturally--just like your hunting boots would. After trying on MX boots last night (I must have missed you at Rusty's), I learned that even most MX boots will allow your ankle to bend sideways. I was surprised about that. I'm pretty much basing my boot decision on the one providing the most ankle immobilization. Maybe that's stupid, and if so, I hope some people will educate me here.

I was wearing Oxtar Infinity boots when I messed up my ankle at Milford. That is nothing against the boots--they are very nice. They are intended to be more dual-sport oriented. They are definitely not motocross boots.

Closeout Rusty wrote:Troy, here is your homework assignment: Read all you can about PodMX knee braces (the one's distributed by Fox Racing) so you'll be ready to have an intelligent discussion with me next week.

Here is a link to get you started: http://www.podmx.com/

Seriously, these things look great, so I ordered a bunch for the store.

Thanks for the link, Rusty. Those things DO look great. I tried on the EVS Vision's in your store, and I have to say they seemed comfortable and I can't see why they would not do a fantastic job of protecting the knee. They are also high quality. I'll just have to try these new PodMX braces on and see if they give me reason, but at $225 vs well over $600 (?), it may not be too difficult of a decision.

Thanks for the help--now and in the past, Rusty. You run a very nice store, offer great prices, and although I'm sure Internet sales are a bigger profit-center for you, having the local store is very convenient for us. I like to see and touch and try this stuff on before I buy. I'm glad you are personally into dualsport riding and stock a lot of dualsport-friendly gear. Many shops have Harley, Crotch-Rocket, and/or Motocross gear. You've got all that plus a nice selection of gear aimed at us dualsport riders.

Closeout Rusty wrote:Troy, here is your homework assignment: Read all you can about PodMX knee braces (the one's distributed by Fox Racing) so you'll be ready to have an intelligent discussion with me next week.

Here is a link to get you started: http://www.podmx.com/

Seriously, these things look great, so I ordered a bunch for the store.

PLEASE let us know when you are ready for people to come look at these in your store.